Sep 2009
I’ve always wondered how a shrewd Businessman could get away for so long being a d*** in this industry without eventually having everything come crashing down on him. Well, I’m not shrewd Businessman, but I’ve been played by one like a fiddle so to speak. Awhile back, long before said Businessman came into the picture, I started shooting for a local tuning and customization shop that built highly recognizable high end cars for clients and for show. For years we worked seamless together, booking covers and shooting amazing feature pieces for magazines.
One day, that all came crashing to a stop when enter said Businessman. A verbal agreement that we made for pictures of a car soon turned into one of the biggest mistakes I could possibly make. See, this verbal agreement I made was that I would give high resolution pictures for internal promotion of the company. Before I knew it, I was literally taking a s*** on the toilet when I ran across one of said images in an advertisement in a 170K/month circulation magazine. A company I’ve never contacted before, a few calls and emails later, I found out the image was handed down by the “Businessman”.
Given the economy and photography being a main source of my income to provide for my family, I thought it was a cheap blow, one that was denied at first actually. After a few lengthy emails, a few phone converations, the Businessman said he would make it up to me by trying to get me shoots of other cars for more higher end commercial work, because lets be honest. A full page ad in a 170k circulation magazine in more than one issue is a lot of money I lost. That never did happen.
I agree’d, knowing that true business relationships work via compromise and sacrifice, rather than crying about it and dropping everything. I’ve been cautious with the Businessman moving forward, but it seems like I’m only getting stuck in different situations, one after the other. I’ve always been cautious of sending out high resolution images, to any one, other than the person that paid for them, for exactly these types of reasons, which brings me to the whole point of this rant/blog.
As of today, I’m no longer the preferred photographer of this company and of this Businessman because I refused to give them high resolution pictures of all their cars for their ‘website’. Instead, my plan was to give them hand selected/edited shots of their cars with both our logos, but thats a lot of time and work for something they want for nothing. It’s sucks because I’ve been put in a situation, for me, wasn’t in my favor either way. They pretty much put me into a situation, give us what we want, or we drop you. I stand by good business ethics, and I respect those that do the same, but when you try and push me into a corner and force me to do something because you think you can get away with it, then all respect is lost.
Best of luck to guys that I really enjoyed working with at the shop, you guys always made each shoot a blast and it sucks that unfortunate events played out the way they did and we can no longer work together because I hold higher standards than most.
To the Businessman, I guess the best words I can come up with are, Well Played.
To Myself, never do business without contracts ever again.
September 30th, 2009 at 2:15 pm
Best advice ever given to me was this… “If it ain’t writ, it ain’t shit.”
September 30th, 2009 at 2:36 pm
LOL @ Nate.
September 30th, 2009 at 3:13 pm
Yup… If I had a dollar for every one of these…….. Been there WAY more than i like to admit. If you have the time let me tell you about the Hydrogen powered super car….
September 30th, 2009 at 3:31 pm
sucks for them josh. you deserve way better than to be treated that way.
September 30th, 2009 at 9:29 pm
I would call this being penny wise and pound foolish.
You got taught a lesson… and your upset… if those pictures hadn’t been given to said manufacturer you picture wouldn’t have made the ad anyway, paid for even. Add it to your portfolio and move on. You got paid for the shoot as it was when it went to press. Now that you have spammed the forums like a spoiled 10 year old that is all about money you have probably lost more shoots then this one picture theoretically would of paid you. Bravo!
Hopefully your replacement is a real photographer, not a photoshop post production guy like they used to use.
September 30th, 2009 at 10:08 pm
Sounds like said business man read this ^ LOL…Idiot
Anyway good luck, I have nothing but respect for someone like you, keep the unreal work coming
September 30th, 2009 at 10:31 pm
What goes around comes around. I know it sucks, Josh, but people like that always get what is coming to them. “Businessman” can’t operate that way forever and not piss on the wrong person. At least you can move on (and up)… good luck!
…and to the /other/ Joe… show me one magazine that has photos in it that haven’t been through post production editing. Your comment shows your ignorance of the industry. Any photographer worth his weight is a master in Photoshop.
October 1st, 2009 at 6:15 am
@ the first Joe,
Not sure where you’re getting your details. But you are incorrect. The shoot wasn’t paid for, wasn’t compensated for, and there was no authorization for the picture to be used in the ad. The pictures were taken prior to the feature shoot of the car for the magazine as a sneak preview of the car before it went to SEMA.
You show your true ignorance by ignoring the facts and even suggesting I was even paid for them. And spamming forums? I posted this blog on a Photo forum to warn other photographers on how to avoid bad business practices. There are no names mentioned here, no links to any photos, nothing that directly relates to anyone.
As far as I’m concerned, I could be talking about anyone.
October 1st, 2009 at 8:10 am
@ First Joe:
Assumption is the mother of all fuck-ups. Either you’re completely assuming facts here or you’re simply on the other side of the coin and trying to spread misinformation to make you or the people you represent look better. No matter what side I’m on (I of course happen to be on Josh’s side here), the plain and simple fact of the matter is even if he DID get paid for the shoot, that gives the “businessman” in this situation absolutely NO RIGHT to give the photos to a third party and let them use them as they wish. As Josh said, now all business from now will involve contracts, but that doesn’t take away from the fact that this specific situation is full of BS.
As for your comment about “a photoshop post production guy,” welcome to the world of professional photography. Perhaps your point-and-shoot or iPhone camera will do just fine for your needs, but the rest of the professional world requires talented people like Josh. This comment from you alone speaks volumes about what you know about Josh and the photography industry as a whole.
October 1st, 2009 at 8:22 am
I’d also add something specifically responding to this comment:
“if those pictures hadn’t been given to said manufacturer you picture wouldn’t have made the ad anyway, paid for even.”
This alone implies that Josh’s photos were given to the manufacturer either in an effort of good will toward Josh, or at Josh’s request/approval. Josh has clearly stated that wasn’t the case, and if it was truly done in good will, this blog post wouldn’t even have been written. Thus, the only conclusion is that the photos were given to the manufacturer without Josh’s knowledge or approval, which of course is the whole point of this blog post. As with many things in this world, the ends do not justify the means, especially when no photo credit was given to Josh in the end anyway. Simply adding it to his portfolio and moving on would be like me taking an ad from Ford in Motor Trend and adding it to my portfolio as if I took the photo, even though the photo can’t be traced back to me in any way as being the photographer.
November 10th, 2009 at 5:07 pm
Josh, from what you say, this sounds like a violation of your copyright. Check with a copyright attorney, especially if you have found copies of image in print, or you can copy it from the web.
November 10th, 2009 at 5:59 pm
Gary,
I’ve already gone down that road, my lawyer told me that I didn’t file my copyright within the specified amount of time for it to apply. He said I could probably press charges and win, but at most would pay for his fees, nothing else.
November 11th, 2009 at 7:38 am
Actually, it is my understanding that all photographers’ work is copyrighted from the click of the shutter. You automatically have a copyright on it whether you have filed, or not. The filing usually means that you can go after the big bucks (including criminal copyright infringement), but if you sue in small-claims court, you may be able to collect the amount you would have normally charged for the shoot. Another way to deal with this is in the court of public opinion. I once got paid by a reluctant construction company for an aerial shoot we had done for them, by promising to picket their client’s offices with a sign saying they weren’t paying their vendors, as the client was involved, too. I told them I would also call the media, and maybe they could have 15 minutes of infamy on the 11 o’clock news. I hadn’t been paid the balance of their bill for about 6 months. They paid up right away the day I made that call. There’s a bit more to it than that, but it would take more time and space than you and I have here. There are many ways to skin a cat. Like they used to say, don’t get mad, get even.
Gary
November 21st, 2009 at 1:07 am
Josh,
I have been in this road before many times. As a professional Director of photography it is a shame that Crooks not businessman take advantage to our art. I have dealt with companies like yourself with this type of treatment. What I usually do is to find a happy medium and just move on and not dwell in it. As for copyrights. You do own it when you you start push the button and since you have masters that goes in your favor 100%. As for videos I own everything thing, that I shoot. For clients wanting stock footage they pay extra or other request the want.
Good Luck. Im a fan of your work.
December 9th, 2009 at 4:05 am
very good work .
May 31st, 2010 at 6:57 am
Very nice post. Do you accept guest writers?